Yaro Starak On Turning Your Blog Into A Profit Machine

Today I interview Yaro Starak. Yaro is the ultimate authority on using your own personal blog to not just get more traffic to your website, but to actually make sales from that traffic. In this episode he shares his secrets on everything from coming up with new content approaches, to using storytelling to engage his readers and turn them into customers, to using your blog to put people into your funnel and have it work its magic.

PLUS I share with you a way to get my own course, The Funnel Formula (sells for $497)… FREE when you invest in Yaro’s new course he’s launching this week.

Make sure to SHARE this podcast/episode with your friends, then leave us a REVIEW and get my “101 Conversion Tips” Cheat Sheet… free! Send an email to [email protected] with the name on your review.

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Resources Mentioned

* www.Jeremyreeves.com/Yaro
* www.entrepreneurs-journey.com

Want To Work With Me?

Visit http://www.JeremyReeves.com or email me at [email protected]



Jeremy Reeves: Hey guys welcome back to another episode of the Sales Funnel Mastery podcast this is your host, Jeremy Reeves and today I have on the line Yaro Starak and I have actually been following Yaro for years now pretty much since I really got into — when I first started my journey, it was in the affiliate world and I was doing blogging and that kind of thing and that is actually where I found him, it is probably about 7 or 8 years ago something like that, give or take a year or two.

I have known about him for a long time, we finally kind of met up and got on the phone here. Yaro is from www.entrepreneurs-journey.com.

So basically he focuses on showing you how to take your blog and become a full-time blogger and even if you own business you are not just doing blogging, how to take that blog and turn it into actual sales. That is one of the mistakes that most people make. They kind of blog just to blog and there is really no strategy behind it.

Yaro really takes that and kind of, you know, multiplies the effect that you get so you get more traffic but not just more traffic actually more sales and we are going to talk about how to use your blog kind of as a like a tool just like you would use Facebook ads or anything else. Use that as one of your tools to get visitors and then put them into your funnel which then sells them your product and services.

So Yaro, how are you?

Yaro Starak: Good Jeremy, thanks for having me. I think we last — it has been 7 or 8 years it has been a long time.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, yeah. I have been kind of watching you from the — you know, kind of stalking you for a little bit. You know, honestly blogging is one of the things that I should be doing more and I do a lot of, a lot of like guest blogging, things like that and it is always working really, really well for me and I just kind of never took that and did it on my own blog.

So I am actually going to be interested in this conversation as well.

So before we get into everything that we are going to talk about tell everybody about you know who you are, what you do and you know, and then we will go from there.

Yaro Starak: Yeah, so my entire adult life pretty much has been spent online. I often say I fell in love with the internet back in 1998 when I was given my first (inaudible 3:40.2) account after enrolling in university in Brisbane, Australia. That was you know, a bit of a moment and it led to the creation of several website.

So the first sort of successful when I had was a card game website about the game called Magic: The Gathering which I played in high school and little bit in university competitively.

So I started little, basically from magazine-type website and then had an e-commerce store and then also a trading forum where people would trade their cards, so it was like a starting point business, it wasn’t the full time income, but while I was in the university it was a great business to run and learned probably more about internet marketing there than in any other time in my life and that led to wanted to do something a bit more full time and more serious after graduating from university.

So I started what was an editing business. I was sort of trying to model the ebay model of connecting many buyers to many sellers. So I was trying to connect many editors and proofreaders, academic editors and proofreaders with university students, I am acting as a middle man between those 2 people predominantly students at English-speaking universities but they are coming from a non-English first language country.

So they need a lot of help with their academic writing and that business was great. It was my full-time income post graduating university for a good number of years and it was actually in 2004 where someone said to me you should get a blog going because it is great for getting traffic from Google and you can pretty much just write this blog and you will get customers to your editing business was kind of like the conclusion I got. It did not work out that way, I did start a blog for the editing business but it was very difficult to write about editing and proofreading, a very, very boring subject for me, but it did teach me what blogging was compared to you know static brochure website which what everyone had back then.

And that translated into a desire to explore this medium more but talk about different subjects. So by then I already had 6 or 7 years experience running online businesses, so that is when I registered this entrepreneurs-journey.com domain name purely thinking it is going to be hobby, you know, the domain was a bit janky. I started writing about what it is like to be an online entrepreneur, trying to, you know, reach out and connect to other people doing similar things and you know, it kind of (inaudible 6:06.9) now became my full-time business and took off and I sold my other businesses over the next few years and then, you know, after a couple of years of successfully making an income from blogging, I started teaching and that really, I think at that time probably close to around the time you would have heard about me, I launched one of the — I think it is the first professional blogging course.

So the first course that taught how to make money blogging back in 2007 so that is when I think I can get a lot of exposure, a lot of people came across to my work, but since then, I basically have been teaching people how to make money blogging but it has really turned a little bit in the last 3 or 4 years to like you said actually because back when I started blogging everyone was doing exactly what you said which sort of throwing content out the door and you make money because it was easier in the sense that you could just publish articles, Google what rewards you would traffic, you could slap some AdSense on or sell some banners yourself, maybe do a bit of affiliate marketing and you figure out the way to make a full-time income from it, where today that’s you know very half hazard strategy but it is probably not going to work, so you have to be much more strategic and that is why the process of going towards the sales funnel, selling your own products and service I believe has become so much more important and that is what I basically did around 2012, I said I am not doing anymore advertising, I am not focusing on affiliate marketing. I am focusing on my own products building a funnel.

So I sort of spent the last 3 years building out a product (inaudible 7:38.5) in the funnel and trying to build a machine that runs behind my blog so that I can happily type away and write articles but knowing I am getting customers as a result of that, so that is what were up today.

Jeremy Reeves: Nice, nice, yeah. That is a pretty cool story and I like that you took it like kind of a round robin, you know, all the way from the beginning, and I resonate with a lot of that stuff because even when you are talking about, you know, years ago you have been able to just throw up content and you know there wasn’t many competitors and Google did not really figure out how to, you know, I mean, you could do so many things to just, you know (inaudible 8:12.8) at Google, yeah, I remember putting keywords in the bottom of the page and white text.

And then just do the AdSense and that kind of stuff and that is what I did, you know, I have blogs like that selling fitness products and all kinds of stuff back, you know, back in 2008 I think it was or may be 2007 something like that, yeah, I remember those days it is so much easier.

Yaro Starak: For me, at (inaudible 8:41.4) one thing was very different back then compared to today. Everyone link to each other much more readily back then, you know. We did not have social media or so much. There was no Facebook, you know, the viral sharing on social media but bloggers would share each other’s content constantly like you do not have to even ask, you know, (inaudible 8:57.6) would publish a link to my blog once a week just because I had something relevant for bloggers, you know.

Everyone was sort of cross linking but I think today it has gotten so crowded it still happens but it is not quite the same or become kind of more insular where you know we’re trying to — I guess everything is bigger, that is basically the short answer so you know we are all building businesses now.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, nice, nice. So let’s get in. You were talking about kind of your journey the last couple of years and you realized how important having a funnel was. So what did that looked like. We will start with you, you know, what did that looked like for you and how did you, you know, what kind of strategy when you were into it and you were doing affiliate stuff and then you said, you know what, I need my own stuff then I got to have my own funnel and you know take all the profits myself essentially and use my blogging skills to then sell my own products.

How did you — how did you kind of go about that process? And what is your funnel look like today?

Yaro Starak: Yeah, it is 2 phases really. So phase 1 was good old internet marketing advice which I was reading over and over again sort of in the mid 2000s you must have your own product if you really want to make good money.

So I made $5 to $10 grand a month from advertising and selling affiliate products pretty much just with the blog and a freshly start email list. You know, I blog for a year before even having an email list which was a bit of mistake, but once I started getting more internet marketing training then I started to see how powerful email was.

So that allowed me to start considering doing a product, you know, I — like a lot of people, I was scared of will someone buy my stuff, you know. It is kind of safer to promote an affiliate product and if you do not make any sales it is not such a big deal but if you go in and do a launch and create your own ebook or your own course or membership site or something and then no one buys it — you are kind of really afraid of that. It is like being rejected when you are trying to ask someone for a date, you know. No one wants to buy my stuff.

So I had the usual fear and I think everyone does when they are just getting started about doing that. So, you know, I probably wasted about 8 months writing an ebook I never released and then when I released blog mastermind, my sort of first course back in 2007, the first version of it, it did well and it skyrocketed my income and that is when I went from making just salary to making over 6 figures a year.

So that prove the point you have got to have your own product right, step 1. So I took that to (inaudible 11:24.1) released 2 more courses over the next 2 or 3 years one myself and one with a partner of mine, Gideon Shalwick, a video course, and we did really well, you know. That is how my business grew to selling over a million dollars worth of products through blogging and it taught me, Yes, products are great, but around that time I was also learning about this sales funnel concept.

So, you know, I kept studying into the marketing and everyone was talking about, not everyone, (inaudible 11:52.0) it certainly talked about more nowadays so back then those sort of the — the internet marketers are really in the trenches, we are talking about how you have to have a frontend product and then leads to you know upsales and then you have backend offers, and I got the logic, it made sense, you know. A lower price product to get people through the door, you will sell more of a lower price product so it will have more customers and therefore you can sell the higher price item still (inaudible 12:17.8) hyperresponsive customers plus it allowed you to create a funnel which you could use (inaudible 12:24.5) traffic for and that is — (inaudible 12:26.6) hammered this concept (inaudible 12:29.3) in a course I took, he said, if your business is based on launches, you do not have a business. You need to be out to consistently source leads convert to know lifetime visitor value of the customer so you can grow a business and you have other people grow it for you, you know, other people can source traffic, other people can even create product and things for you.

So I took that to heart but unfortunately, I think I burned out in product creation (inaudible 12:53.7) when I created 3 courses. I have done a ton of launches it was a very good 3 years. I made a lot of money but I just did not see myself sitting down and going and creating a bunch of new products, a bunch of frontend ebooks or something like that and doing all the emails required to link everything together.

So I kind of put it all on hold to be absolutely honest and I actually startup in 2011 with a friend of mine, Walter Haas. It was a blog advertising system and I just — I wanted to do something that was more tech silicon valley startup, less internet marketing sort of in (inaudible 13:27.7) publishing kind of world.

And we had a good 2 year run with that business. It got some traction primarily because I had my own audience but we quickly realized we did not want to be in the space we were entering which was online advertising. We did not want to be sort of following people to try and convince them to buy ads and so on.

So we kind of realized we either pivot completely, throw ourselves into an industry who do not want to be in or we stop. So we ended up stopping that one because we just did not want to do a startup and that kind of taught me that I did not want to do a silicon valley tech startup because it is kind of a job where you have a 12-hour a day, if you get investors, you suddenly got people you to have be accountable to because you are spending their money. It felt like a, kind of like the almost opposite of what I have been preaching and living with a, you know a lifestyle business because before then I have been all 2-hour workday so they are talking about even before Tim Ferriss was talking about you know the 4-hour work weeks.

So I was totally onboard of that movement and I was living it and living it since the days of my editing business back in the early 2000. So I was not doing 12-hour a day, I was doing 2 hours here, 3 hours there, you know, eating lunch for a couple hours, watching back before Netflix, watching whole tv series and you know, socializing, exercising just really relaxing and having a great balance and I saw that is so important.

So tech startup is not balanced and that is fine that is just the way that is, that is kind of like work hard and sell out and make a lot of money where I prefer the sort of work balance to make good money while you were doing it and that experience showed me how important that was to me, so when we closed everything down towards sort of — start of 2012 I was like — I am going to go back and I felt rejuvenated basically to really build a funnel and do it properly.

By then though I chap down every course I had. So I was essentially starting from scratch when it came to product. I had my blog and my audience still. I have been keeping that going, enjoying riding. I always love driving but I did not have a product so it was kind of nice because I had the power of being able to structure a funnel from start to finish in my head and then execute it in a certain order without the pressure of you know, I have got to make certain amount of money from this within, you know, certain amount of time.

So I could say (inaudible 15:49.4) we will build a lower price product first even though I know I would not make the big money until I do the backend stuff, but there is a logic of sequence here, so my thinking back then was — and this is literally what I spent the last 3 years creating and executing this vision.

I have done a few things and I know how to teach a few things and I can see some frontend products, so I had a vision for product on blog traffic, being a very popular subject. Frontend product and mindset and productivity and a fronted product on buying and selling blogs and website as a sort of investment strategy which is something I did for a number of years as well. And I also wanted to get a product based on podcasting in the sense that if you are giving away free audio and your good at creating interviews why not create a product that is interviews so I wanted to do kind of like the old CD of the month club that people you know might remember, you subscribe to get a CD in the mail, in might be an interview or I subscribe to a couple Perry Marshall and Eben Pagan, so they send me an interview and I pay $30 a month or something like that.

So I thought why not do something like that for MP3 interview, so — and the way I started to see this was, okay, these are frontend products targeting specific niches in my niche (inaudible 17:08.8) money and blogging. The interview product is a great upsale, it’s — you know, do you want to have a 1 month free trial when you buy the ebook, so that is my first upsale.

So I ended up creating the interview product first, then creating the ebooks and then once all the ebooks were done I could bundle them so you could buy all 3 for the price of 2 at the checkout instead. So it gave me a lot more options, but of course that was all leading to the creation of you know flagship course which was very clear in my head there was a lot of need from my blog mastermind training but the whole program needs to be recreated from scratch because it was back in 2007 I needed a current methodology and which is what I was practicing myself then I was — as I have said no longer doing advertising, no longer doing affiliate marketing. I was focusing on various strategic email sequences.

So each of those ebooks has a specific sequence of blog posts that are link together through an email course that lead to the selling of that product. That product then has the bundle options, the upsale options and then it leads eventually to the backend product as you know, the next step if they want to take that.

So that is pretty much where I am at today as we were recording this. Everything I thought about in 2012 has been done except for a few email sequences. Most of my job for the next year is actually going to be sitting at cafes and writing backend email sequences and engagement sequences to link all the products I have created in the last 3 years together.

Jeremy Reeves: Nice, nice and I like that. It is important to you know, to get them all the — to link together. I was actually just talking to someone yesterday and he was doing really good. He sold like an an $11 product. It was just like a really low end like, you know that kind of thing and you know, he is like, oh I have $20,000 customers, I am like, Oh what else do you sell them.

So I said you know what else do you have to sell them and he was like, nothing I just had the 1 product and I am like, Oh my God, c’mon, like you have 20,000 customers and you are not selling them anything but a $10 product, you know.

Yeah, so needless to say, I am going to be helping him, figure that out.

Yaro Starak: Yeah, seriously.

Jeremy Reeves: But yeah, I mean it is important to have all the backend stuff because that is — and a lot of people miss that, it is like — it is exciting getting customers for the first time, you know what I mean, like the frontend. It is definitely the most exciting part of business, the frontend product from whatever reason just you know, you are turning them from prospect into a customer. It is — for some reason, it is not as exciting to turn a customer into a higher end and repeat customer, you know, but it is so crucial if you want to actually grow your business, you know, you need that backend.

You know I am glad to hear that over the last couple of years everything is kind of come in together, you know, that is good.

Yaro Starak: You know, I think for me, the most exciting part was like — because I sold product before but what I have not done was just have a blog with an automated email sequence that sells a product with an upsale and knowing that that would sell without me doing anything because in the past it was all send out a bunch of emails for launching something, right.

I sold affiliate products off the back of just blog post but it is different when you wake up and you have sold an ebook because someone, you know, done a Google search, come across a blog post, joined an email list, gone through a sequence of messages that you know wrote strategically to educate and build trust and then make an offer for this frontend product and then they bought it and you did not do anything that was all — you created that 2 months ago or something.

So I think the moment I made the first ebook sale was really validating moment that the machine can work behind the platform that you build, you know.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, yeah, it really is. I remember my first, you know the first one when I sold, and even my wife and I were actually just — we just took the kids on a little get away over this last past weekend and when I woke up, I took the weekend off, I did not even check the email or anything and then I woke up Monday morning and looked at my product sales and realized that the product sales just over the weekend paid for the entire vacation that we just went, you know, actually more than — so it is a very cool you know experience when it just, it just happens.

Yaro Starak: When you get there.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, like you do not have to send out a broadcast, you do not have to do an affiliate promotion, you do not have to like set up this big JV launch and all that kind of stuff, it just happens regularly. And that is, you know, most of what I do for, you know, with my clients and all that, setting all that up for them.

Yaro Starak: Yeah, I mean you know, I mean obviously you and I got in touch because I am doing a big launch, you know and it is reminding me how much more work (inaudible 21:54.4) big launches, you know, like all these contacts, all these setting up for pages, you know. Basically, hoping and praying everyone will promote what you are doing at the same time. I have always love the idea of being in control of your audience, right and that is why obviously having a list is a good thing but — and this is I think where I, like I have really benefited is having a blog and building something long term because — and this is something I am not proud of but I have not actually done much buying traffics, but I have been able to do what I do because the leads keep coming from blog post I wrote 7 years ago, 6 years ago, and you know — you do not (inaudible 22:35.0) that is why I am big proponent blogging itself because it can be a huge traffic source plus I think it is still one of the best sort of — it is the best platform even if you are doing paid traffic.

For example, you are sharing content on Facebook ads, chances are you are sharing an article from your blog on a Facebook ad but yes it is meant to get them onto a converting email list, but it is still content that begins the conversation through blogging so you know, I am always raving about the need for blogs.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, yeah. Like you said like, you have not done much paid but everybody has things — like that is your strength, so you know, if you are not into paid and you do not like the risk and you do not know how to do it and set it up and you know be continually testing and tweaking the funnel to make it work and all that kind of stuff then there is really no point in doing that because it is not what you are good at, you know, that is not like your strength. Your strength is doing, you know, doing blogging and doing that all the right way so that you do not have to worry about paid traffic, you know.

So let us kind of switch gears and talk you know more about actual like blogging you know strategies and tactics and things like that to get them into your funnel, you know, so things like you know the structure (inaudible 23:49.9) and the quantity and like how often you should be doing it and things like that.

So one of the things I have always been curious of is, you know, I have heard — I think I heard this from, it might have been (inaudible 24:01.5) I do not know, somebody. But like — blogging, you know what are your thoughts on blogging like in the aspect of, should you be doing blogging every day, every week, every you know once a month, you know, does the quantity matter and then when you put out a post, is it more effective to put out more post or to put out less post and then focus on the promotion of the post? Does that make sense?

Yaro Starak: Yeah, totally. I know Derek has been a big proponent of — it is about (inaudible 24:34.5) more marketing than contact creation. I certainly agreed with him it has changed back when I started (inaudible 24:40.5) write everyday because we just get reward for doing that. Today, you better off you know, to put a bit of effort into 1 amazing post and then going out there and promoting it, but I think there is even a step before that that needs to be addressed and I am always been a big strategic thinker and this is something that I only really applied once I fully adopted the concept of the blog sales funnel or the sales funnel in general.

And it is so, even the way you ask this question does not include this thing and it really should which is, deciding on the business intent of content before you produce it. And that is the question that a lot of people do not know how to answer especially if you are new to this like people think well I know this, I will write some blog posts, I will get some traffic (inaudible 25:24.4). Yes, I will have to market a bit harder. I will have to push some on Facebook, I have to do some guest writing, I am going to bring this people back to my blog and then they are going to join my email list and buy my stuff.

That is kind of like the basic idea, but you are missing the strategic intent behind the content itself. So the way I like to look at it is — and it works brilliantly with the funnel because you think, okay, I have created this funnel, the sequence of the frontend, we will call it the frontend funnel for the time being, series of frontend information. It is very targeted right, you know.

For example, I have got a client who deals with adult acne and she has an academy basically for that. So — which she has an email sequence that is going to give — gives advice on how to deal with acne if you are an adult woman basically.

So I do not know how linear she has gotten with it lately but for example, you could have the — I am going to teach the food aspect, the diet aspect of this and there is going to be an email sequence that strategically information on how to eat right and know what to do with your acne, if you are an adult woman, and that then sells your academy or your frontend ebook whatever it is you sell.

Now that is a much more linearnish specific subject then just general treating acne. So you are going after the food aspect and you are going after women. So when you go in produce blog content or do more marketing in general, you have to think well how do I get that person with this content, because that is what you are doing.

So it then dictates what goes into the blog post, the language you use in the blog post, how you write the headline for the blog post and then it dictates where are you going to try and get an exposure for it, you know. You might even write a core big blog post for the blog knowing that you are going to do some guest posts on, you know, some women’s magazines, revealing the hidden aspects of diet when it comes to acne treatment. You are going to do guest posts specifically on that subject to bring them back specifically to this longer more in depth blog post specifically to get them to opt into the funnel that leads to them buying that product as they go through, you know, more free information about that.

But it makes you think about — alright, who am I going after, what am I selling, where I want them to go through my business and that is all much more strategic then I am just going to write some post and market them.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah. And I can even see like, you know, one good question to make it really simple is when you are sitting down and you are saying, okay I am going to write blog post or like a lot of my you know, the people listening to this probably are not doing the blog post themselves, some of them would be. But a lot of people are going to have content writers on their team right, me included because I have kind of a side business and set up the exact same way.

So I can even see like instead of just saying, okay let us do, you know, this topic and this topic, just ask yourself why, you know, why are you doing that topic, you know, how does that — does it lead into and (inaudible 28:30.7) that you have, does it lead into, you know, the next so like does it kind of pre sell them on one of your products, does you know — like you were just talking about.

But I think, I think the big thing here is just asking why and not just doing it to do it, but doing it for an actual purpose.

Yaro Starak: Yeah, I made that shift in the last — really in the last year particularly with my content because I was writing so many funnels and it is so strange like I used to just kind of write what I was thinking, what I was doing and nothing wrong with that. I built my entire regional blog business on that principle but ever since I have been thinking, well, I am creating funnels and selling products. Usually, when I write a blog post, it is actually part of the funnel, it is like one of the post I would actually send to my email in a sequence that leads to another post that leads to an offer then leads to a special for 1 week with a deadline because that is usually what drives the sales you know and that is — it is all into link.

So in fact if you dig through my most recent blog post to the last sort of 12 months, they all be related to a product. I was either building a funnel for or — in fact, even today in my actual sales pages for products or blog posts. So it is very blog dependent and the email is still the thread that connects everything that all the content now besides the products themselves exists on the blog, so it is blog post, its interviews, its sales pages and it is just about bringing people to the blog and then bringing people to the right post to the right offers and automating that.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah. And it almost sounds like — I have 2 things that popped up while you were saying that. One is that when you were saying that, it almost sounds like you took the product (inaudible 30:10.9) formula and put it into like a blog, you know, concept.

Yaro Starak: Yeah, it is a (inaudible 30:18.7) it is (inaudible 30:19.6) formula combined with sales funnel marketing, combined with blogging and email. That is pretty much it.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, nice. And then the other thing I was thinking of is — I have a lot of clients that do, you know, one of the things with Facebook is that a lot of times like anymore they are starting not to like when you just send the ad right to it, let us just say it is a — landing page whether it is a free report or webinar, whatever it is.

A lot of times they do not really like that anymore and you will pay really high clicks and your relevancy scores really bad so a lot of —

Yaro Starak: Sorry you are just cutting out a bit Jeremy.

Jeremy Reeves: Sorry, can you hear me now? That is not good, Yaro?

Yaro Starak: Yeah, sorry I missed a little bit, buy I know you are saying. You are saying basically landing page or webinar and Facebook ads found on that.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, yeah. So what a lot of people are doing — it is basically like a native ad kind of thing where you build a really, a really, really solid you know blog post and a lot of them are like you know, it is 2000, 3000 words. And then what happens is, in that blog post they have links going to the landing page and then also what they do is retarget them onto the landing page.

So like if they get, you know, whatever 10,000 clicks and a lot of times the clicks are like 30 cents, so they are spending like couple hundred bucks and then they retarget all those people back to the actual landing page.

Kind of like what you were saying is those posts are setup in a way that it presells them on the next step essentially like — it kind of, a lot of times there will be open loops in it and then the landing page or whatever the next step is, kind of closes the loop and that kind of thing and it sounds like a very similar, a very similar strategy you know, and it is something that a lot of people do not do, you know.

We are talking about before, they kind of just right to write and it does not really matter, you know, what it is about, it is kind of just to get content there. Yeah, I think it’s — you know there are so many people that they kind of feel like and you would know more about this than me obviously, but you know, do you feel like a lot of people I feel like would look at blogging and be like, oh, I do not have time for that and that kind of thing, you know, I do not know if it is going to be too much of a long term thing, but it does not really have to be that way I feel.

You know, obviously it is a long term strategy in the sense that, you know, you can get long term results given 10 years, still getting sales and opt in stuff from the things you did, you know, 4, 5, 6, 7 years ago and I have had the same experience with my, you know, the guest articles that I have done. I still get leads from things I have done several years ago.

What are your thoughts on that with like, you know, are there ways to — let us say that somebody does not even have a blog right now and they do not want to wait 6 or 12 months, you know, are they ways to use a blog to be able to get quick results?

Yaro Starak: Yeah, I think — you kind of mention what I think it is inevitable here is you kind of have to have a content platform no matter what you do, even the blog itself is not driving a lot of traffic, it is the place you send your paid leads to because it is much friendlier, put it that way I mean. A blog is what the web looks like today when you go to, you know, read content even if you find the news article, you know, probably through Facebook web space. I think a lot of source are news Facebook now and then it gets driven to you know business insider or Mashable or Techcrunch or whatever in each content site you currently have an interest in whether it is you know, cooking or celebrity gossip or something, it is a blog, it is a site that has got content producers, it has got a navigation bar, it is probably got some ads somewhere on it and that is what we I guess see as a friendly site that is giving us information.

So, you know, you do not have to have a blog that is well developed, years of content in the archives. You could just write the key blog posts on the blog, present it through this as I have said friendly format and then go out there and do buy paid traffic and as you said, send people to specific articles in that post that then lead to the actual opt in process.

So you are actually building trust instead of going, hey stranger come and opt in from my stuff, you are saying, hey stranger read this great post then if you want more, opt in to my stuff. So it is just traditional, I mean, this is marketing 101, build trust, get some goodwill generated before you ascend to do something, do not take a deduction from the goodwill bank before you put something in there. That is what the blog post can do.

So I think everyone is actually gonna have to have a content platform simply for that reason whether you are doing Facebook ads, Google ads, Twitter ads, Pinterest ads, Instagram ads, you know, retargeting across span of network. It is all driving to content and then content opt in and then even the opt in still driving it back to content, let us face it, you know, most people they either putting the content in the email itself or they are linking to post probably on the blog.

So you kind of — kind of (inaudible 35:25.8) in some regard, but I think there is though a spectrum of people who love paid advertising and you just take content, right. The content part is the — do I have to put content, can I just buy ads and send people to my office and they buy it, right. And these people probably are comfortable more so with the marketing and the selling aspect.

They love to get people on the phone to sell their product so they can skip the content, get them started on the phone and try and convert that way, they comfortable with that. People I tend to deal with these sort of introverted content producing but shy blogger types who do not like a hard sell would never want to get people on the phone to try and convert. They just want to write great content and sell their products but they struggle with the selling part, the marketing part.

So but you can find a happy medium where you still use your content but you still source traffic in various way whether through search optimization, through content or it is paid traffic still driving to content, you know, you can find where you fit. I just think the blog is kind of like — it is almost mandatory now unless, you know, depending on your niche if you have a brand new niche maybe that does not have many competitors which frankly I do not if there are any more of those. You know, you can get away with it but I think most, the experience of most paid per click marketers is they might get a rich (inaudible 36:48.4) of traffic that works for a few months and then it gets competed away or something changes in the way at platform let you buy traffic and you start to realize I need a way to first capture leads before trying to make a sale and I have do it in a much more softer content-focus approach.

So the blog is the first step or may be the podcast, you know, which still is hosted on the blog.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, yeah it is true. You were saying with paid traffic, you might have like originating and then it kind of, you know, it either dries up or you are just paying too much. I can personally attest to that because I got — I used to get a lot of my leads for, you know, for copywriting through AdWords and a couple of years ago like 2 or 3 years ago I forgot, it was like roughly a $1 or $1.50 or so a click, right.

And it was like, oh you know this is perfect. And then you know, they did not like that I actually got my client’s results and kick me off. So I got kind of blacklisted from AdWords and then a couple of months ago it has probably been, I do not know, maybe 3 months, I put up like a whole new website and it was like it is really just send me there like no testimonials, there is no result shown like anything which kind of suck because you know, I (inaudible 38:05.2) from my clients but again (inaudible 38:07.2) talk about it just because of the way AdWork does.

But the point in that is I am now paying it, it is only 2 or 3 years later I am now paying like $4 a click whereas it used to be like a $1 or $1.50 you know, for me it is still worth it but for most people it is not, you know. That is happening like all over the place even Facebook now it is, you know, it is getting harder and harder already, you know and it is still a pretty new media platform.

It is already getting harder and harder to make work and you are starting to have to or just used to be you know a couple, I do not know, maybe earlier this year, you could still just send people to landing page and it was just, you know, you are paying a dollar click to a landing page and boom it was beautiful and that kind of thing and then they were like, nope, we do not like landing pages anymore, now you have to go to content and all that kind of stuff and that adds more complexity.

Yaro Starak: It is a near like history repeating itself.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, yeah. I know. And then you know, a couple of years from now there is going to be another big thing and the same thing is going to happen, you know, it is going to — like an Instagram that is one of the new things now. So in the same thing is going to happen there, you know, right now it is cheap clicks. I have not tried it out yet but I want to. It is cheap clicks and that kind of thing and then eventually the whole things going to repeat itself, you know, whereas blogging it just — it has been the same since the first blog was developed. It is written in the same way, you can use the same strategies — I mean it is a lot — the strategies are different now in terms of you know being like you actually have to be strategic, you cannot just throw up content like we were talking about.

But the way that you do it is still pretty much, you know, the same (inaudible 39:52.0) basically the same, you know.

Yaro Starak: Yeah, it is because we control the platform that is all has been the difference, right. I can do my blog whatever I want, were Facebook decides how your ad should be and Youtube decides how your ad should be and Google decides how your ad should be. You know, I love the fact that I control an entire page of testimonials at people and that is not going to get block like you said you experience, right. So in fact, testimonial podcast which pretty much are podcast masking these testimonials or may be testimonials masking the podcast (inaudible 40:25.1) but basically, I do interviews with my successful clients and its great content but it is also a massive endorsement of my stuff.

So you know that is content I send and people love it but it is actually a very overt in some ways picture my products and totally you get away with that the same what you could on you know paid platforms.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, definitely, definitely. Alright, so when you are — let us just say that someone right now is you know, they are like alright this sounds good, I am going to start blogging again or maybe they are already blogging and looking for ways to basically get better results from it.

So we already talked about a bunch of different things to do that but when it comes to — 2 kind of like big questions that I want to make sure. We already went over a quantity, so it is kind of like a mix of you know doing it frequently and then promoting it you know. It is really not clear, it is kind of like you buff essentially.

And then in terms of length and structure those are the 2 big questions that I am kind of curious to know, you know. Have you found in terms of like SCO you know, getting more visitors to the page. Have you find any differences in the length of the blog posts?

Yaro Starak: Yeah well you know, when I started, I was running what you called a magazine blog and I still distinguish these 2 types of blogs. One is a magazine so you are producing a lot of content. You probably got multiple writers and you are doing where news based in the moment content that is not really relevant, you know the week later even a day later sometimes versus an expert based blog which usually is more one individual blogger sharing their content, teaching, advising, educating and then selling their products and services like we have been talking about.

And those types of bloggers they might publish once a month but when they do that it is a fairly in depth robust content piece that is, you know, meant to stand the test of time it is not news it is evergreen it will be that relevant, you know, like I said I wrote a blog post on the 80/20 rule back in 2006. In fact it is still my highest search volume piece of content to my blog it got many because it ranks in the top 3 for the phrase 80/20 rule on the internet on Google.

I wrote that after just learning about the concept myself and applying it to my own life and it continues to deliver that result. I do not think if I have written a news post about a piece of 2006 news that would not be getting me any traffic necessarily right now and that is maybe I wrote about Donald Trump or something like that because (inaudible 42:57.6) right.

So I think the short answer is again, intent behind content. If you are going purely for SCO there is a different strategy for that. If you just want to rank highly then you are going to throw in a lot more keyword research. You are going to throw in competitive research to see what other sites are ranking for that term whatever pages.

So that is why I think the biggest question that everyone drops and forgets about when they start blogging is why am I writing this blog post. What its purpose and really drilled down is it designed to sell a product, is it designed just to get you more traffic through a search engine, is it meant to be thrown out there through a paid advertising, you know, what is it going to do, it probably going to do multiple things like you might say yes, I am trying to get search traffic and I want to use it paid per click and I want to sell my product with it which is fine you know you can achieve that but be cognizant of what you are doing.

So you are going to have to put in you know more work. So from my point of view, I have always been a long post writer, so to go back to your sort of question, way back when people were putting out research saying the post that get shared the most and go viral are between 400 and 700 words that was the research.

At that time I suspect that still holds true if we are talking about that masked consumption entertainment type of content. That is not necessarily unless your job is you are running a magazine. It is not going to what you wanted to do. So I always love to just get everything I thought about a subject out into blog post.

So I predominantly write 2,000 or 3,000 words. If I started pushing towards 4,000 or 5,000 words I break it down into 2 or 3 posts and start creating series. If I really have a lot to say those series would actually become ebooks. So I might write 9 to 10 posts and I compiled them into a pdf download.

So you know you got options and I think, as I have said the intent is more important but also your overall strategy you know. I have got my 2 best case studies ironically people who I have coached in the past who both have blogs that today make several million dollars a year. One is about cars in Australia and one is about basically sports coverage in all over the world and both of those guys are running magazines with teams of writers. One is more of corporate in structure where they got a CEO, you know they are getting ready to (inaudible 45:27.3) stock market. The other one does not have that corporate structure but it still got that were producing 30 blog posts a day or covering news on every sport and they are doing predominantly income from advertising but also affiliate marketing and selling a membership sites.

So you know that (inaudible 45:44.7) can do really well but I think as an individual and most people I work with today, I have people probably like you do who are an expert at something or went through a life experience that allows them to then teach. Now what they are trying to do is take their knowledge, their expertise, their advice and package it into digital content that they can sell and give away for free.

So the blog and the email list becomes vital and writing a 3,000 word blog post on how to each write for covering from adult acne is not going to work in a 700 word blog post. You need the space of thousands of words to really deal with that subject and put pictures in there, maybe a video or two really hammer that home, but then you can go forever and say, you know what, you are diet is not right go read this blog post. You can say that in person, you can say that on a podcast, you can say that on forum when you are interacting with, you can post it on Facebook. You know, you can go everywhere and just be proud and know that this blog is going to really help people and it is going to convert them onto your email list as well because you obviously going to put you know sign up here for my audio series on this subject or my video series on this subject and I have lots of opt in box all over that post in order to convert the lead to.

Jeremy Reeves: Nice, sounds good. Yeah that all make sense. So my last question that I have — that I have always been kind of curious of is how about the structure, you know, the structure like when you sit down and you sit down and you say okay I am going to write a blog post about this and here is the reason why I am going to write it you know you have the intent for it. Is there like any kind of like kind of you know magical structure that you used or is that different based on the type of blog post it is or like for example, you know in copywriting there is like the AIDA formula you know, attention interest desire action or anything like that or do you start off with like a story or you know any kind of like certain structure you follow or is it kind of a different based on the end goal of the post.

Yaro Starak: Yeah, I mean it is copywriting you know it is (inaudible 47:58.7) overlap maybe it is a little bit more narrative than copywriting although I think most good copywriting is very narrative based anyway. I certainly whole heartedly endorse and use constantly storytelling I think you know that is, by far, the most engaging format of content. I think it should be in your products, should be in your blog post, should be in your emails, it should be the start of everything really certainly at sales pages.

What I find as a formula though — you know, first of all you are, going back to that, alright, what is the purpose for this article, you know the purpose of it and you are thinking okay what is my little niche topic here and you might be thinking well let us stick with the same story we have been running with which is the adult acne and diet. You might go I used to eat a lot of fruit, alright.

So you start telling the story about your previous self and how you might wake in the morning, you have a bowl of yogurt with some bananas and you know, so and so and then at lunch time, you have you know an apple maybe then a smoothie in the afternoon and you saw it because it is fruit it was really healthy. Every day you would also wake up with more pimples on your face and you are going, I thought I am eating really healthy how am I getting an acne I am not eating chips, I am not eating chocolate, I am not eating candy not realizing that there might be a correlation between you know the sugars in the fruit or something that can lead to the acne. I am obviously not saying that is necessary the case for the sake of my example here.

Jeremy Reeves: Just an example.

Yaro Starak: You know that sound kind of like could be true. So you know you are telling that story from your previous life and what I like is very much that attention, interest, desire kind of formula maybe not as rigid as that but making sure those elements are in there where you are introducing something you went through or someone you have worked with went through or someone you know went through or may be a celebrity went through and that is the typical heroes journey where they start with the problem but they have an aha moment. I am a really big fan of revealing aha moments through storytelling and that creates the mindset shift necessary to open up their mind to actual how to teaching to.

So story, heroes journey, introduce the problem, they have an aha moment, they see the solution to the problem they experienced it and then you actually tie the blog post off with the here is the how to steps to do this in your life. So that is when you put a dot point list and it is quite well known. You know dot points, bullet point list, numbered list that makes for you know easier digestion of content more likely to be shared so if you can combine storytelling with how to that is chunk down into really easy to apply bullet point steps and then tie it into a next step as well obviously you are ending the post with you know if you, if you actually want my 7 day guide for doing this whole process opt in here and I will send you the download, you know the pdf download.

So it kind of flows from story to educating them on the mindset of the solution to giving them the steps to implement the solution to saying if you want more here is the guide. So that is kind of like roughly the way a lot of my blog posts and email lists you know the call to action can change but it is almost always story first how to set in and then call to action.

I am a big fan of also what I learned through I think Eben Pagan was the first person, the different learning styles where you got the why, what, how, what if. I would not go into much detail but it is pretty simple. Everyone has a different way of basically paying attention to content, you know how you grab them. So if you are why learner, you need to know why you need to listen to this. So you know for this podcast, you would say, you need to listen to this because you are going to see the right way to blog if you want to sell your products and services so that is why you should listen, so that will grab your attention of the why people.

The what people will say, I am interviewing Yaro Starak who has been blogging for 10 years and has perfected a system called the blog sales funnel for selling products and services for only a blog. So that gives them what, what is the science, what is the system, what is the practice this based on, why is it legitimate basically.

And you have got the how, which is pretty straightforward. Step 1 setup a blog. Step 2, setup an email. So you are going to teach people to steps and that is usually what a lot of people on the internet seemed to love. They love how to.

And the last group the what if learners. They are the practicers. They want to actually see how this can be implemented in their life and what they will often do is hear the one thing they need to hear in something and then run away and do it. So you often need to say, for example if you listen to this podcast with Yaro Starak you are going to be able to go away, setup your blog and make 2 or 3 specific strategic blog post that will lead to selling more of your products and you can go away and do that immediately after listening to this podcast.

So that is giving them the what will happen if they apply what if in this education. So I pretty much cover all 4 of those in most of my major piece of the content so free reports, products, you know webinars maybe not in every blog post because it kind of be, you know difficult to do it in 2000 words but if you keep yourself aware of stories as well as the learning styles call to action and then you can do pretty well.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah. That was awesome. That was worth (inaudible 53:34.0) people listening to that, you know, worth listening to the whole interview and you know plus everything else (inaudible 53:39.5) but yeah that really helps them and I fully agree by the way and you know as everybody knows like I am copywriter doing every day of my life and storytelling really is like the best way because what happens like the big thing with storytelling, the reason why I work so well is because when people are reading sales messages and when they are reading really any kind of content, they always have like — they always have like the flags coming up you know. They are waiting for some reason to not want to listen to you, you know and so they are looking for that reason and they are kind of like defensive when they are reading it and storytelling allows you to kind of slip under that and tell them what you want to tell them but like masked by the story, you know what I mean. Like there is a lot of — I forgot what they call it, I mean there is a million things even the you know, even like things like the bible you know, I mean that is basically one big long story that is teaching you all these like life lessons etc.

And really that is — it is the best way to tell people what you want them to believe by the end of the page whether it is a sales letter or blog post or whatever it is without raising those flags you know, so I would highly, highly recommend if there is anything that you guys get out of this its start telling more stories and everything that you do, whether it is blog post, whether it is a sales letter or emails, regardless of this and anybody on my email list knows that pretty much every email that goes out there is some kind of story attached to it you know.

Jason Swenk: You know, I read some (inaudible 55:11.4) actually writing some copy and I want to really explain the importance of storytelling and there was this Spanish academic study where they were scanning brains and watching what part of the brain fired up basically listening to (inaudible 55:24.6) you know reading an ad or telling the story or something.

So what they had is they had basic content that did not use more descriptive language, it was you know more facts and figures and it could be describing the features rather than the benefits if you are looking in copywriting right, and only 1 part of the brain fired up, but when they started to describe things in more emotive language like describing a smell or describing a feeling or you know something that actually fires up a different part of the body not just the analytical part but when you think of a smell, you actually start to smell it.

So your brain fires up the smelling part of you know the (inaudible 56:01.6) actually smelling the smell. The brain thinks you are because you are thinking about it. So what was interesting was the you know the retention and the engagement was so much higher when you are activating those other parts of the brain rather than the just purely analytical part and it made me think, yeah, this is the key because a story works because you put yourself in the footsteps of the people in the story right, the protagonist so you feel them climbing the mountain in the Lord of the rings, you know, same with the movie, you know, you feel the intense, the rush of the adrenaline when you are racing the car where if you just talking about this is the fast car, you know, it does not give you that cross-body functions experience and that is how why, how and why storytelling can work so much better because as you have said, it bypasses that I am just getting sold (inaudible 56:51.5) telling me about product versus I am smelling and experiencing and feeling the sadness, the happiness, the achievement whatever it is that story takes the person through and then it connects it with the product and you have got you know, great marketing, great copywriting.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah and that is the key with stories like you cannot just — it is almost the same as you know a big theme of what we have been talking about is you actually have to have an intent behind the story just like behind the blog post, you know.

Just because you are telling a story does not mean that it is the right story like, you know. I can be selling a car and if I am telling somebody a story about how you know, I went to you know India and rode an elephant you know, there is really no — there is really no connection between that you know.

So just because it is a story does not mean it is going to help you sell. You have to you know, the story has to have a purpose, you know. It has to have a lesson in it or you know be able to like explain something that (inaudible 57:48.2) you know or whatever the case is.

Yaro Starak: Although I bet you could tie the elephant to a car but you know slow travel versus quick travel, you know.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah and that is a good skill to have is being able to take stories in your life. The other day, I have — I do not know if you know the money tree is, but it is basically just a plant and it is called the money tree but I have one of these. I have one in my office and the other day I was going and I noticed there is like a little bit of dust on one of the leaves so I was like, I was kind of like you know getting some of the dust off of the leaves and that kind of thing and I came back and I forgot what the transition was but I came back and I actually wrote copy based on that like just based on touching a plant, you know.

For some reason, it reminded of me something. I cannot think of what it was of the top of my head but having that ability to be able to say, okay you know, I just waxed my shoes and how was that — how can I apply that to like you know, turn into story which teaches a lesson you know, maybe — I do not know if you are selling something on like personal development, you could talk about how you know, you are waxing your shoes and it reminded you of how important it is to have patience with your children, I do not know, you know, something like that.

That is really an important skill to have and it is one thing like, I do not think it comes naturally for a lot of people it is something that you have to purposely do you know, and I actually used to — before I really started getting an emails and stuff, I mean this is years and years and years ago. I actually used to just look at things in my room and just randomly like closed my eyes and point to something and forced myself to come up with a story based on whatever I was pointing at. It could be like the ceiling, it could be you know, the rug, it could be door handle and then somehow make a transition from that into you know, an email or blog post whatever. And then you get good at it.

Yaro Starak: Exactly. I mean that is — I am never been a paid copywriter or train copywriter but you keep blogging, you are exactly right. You have to keep seeing stories in every moment of your life and it translates into content and even if you are not — I think you should blog this for the sake of that reason alone just to practice the art of writing and the art of storytelling that leads to selling to. But even if you are not necessarily a content creator, you have to use copy. Your ads have to have copy, your emails have to have copy. You cannot get away having internet business without some kind of copy.

So practicing the art is definitely worthwhile.

Jeremy Reeves: Definitely, definitely. Alright, so I learned a lot on this. I know just — you know, from my own kind of personal use and I am sure anybody that is listening to this. If you have a blog, I am sure that you have already heard a bunch of different things that you should be doing to improve the results you are getting. And if you do not have a blog, hopefully we kind of sold you on the idea that you need one, you know.

Like Yaro said it is not really a matter of like having one or not like it should be a necessity that you have one. It is a matter of how often you do it and how much you are utilizing it you know, because like you said you can use it — you can have 1 blog post and it is kind of like a multifaceted thing. You can use it to get SCO and you know generate leads and sales and use it for a paid post like for Facebook or whatever or use it for JV Partners to send people to you know, whatever the case is you know, put it in forms and all that kind of stuff.

So you definitely need to do all these. So before we get off I just want to take a second you know, let everybody — there are 2 things you know, first of all let everybody know how they can get in touch with you and maybe follow your blog and that kind of thing and then when we’re going to be releasing this. You are starting kind of your prelaunch for your blog mastermind 2.0 and I want to — I am going to send everybody to a link that I have and basically my kind of offer that I am going to give everybody if they you know, well first of all you know, just sign up for whatever is you know, whatever he is doing like with the content because the content is going to be outstanding you know, just alone even if you do not buy the course and everything like that.

But what I am going to do is if anybody goes through my link and buys Yaro’s new course that is coming out with as you know, the link will send you to. I am actually going to give you a copy of my own course, the funnel formula which is $500 on its own by the way. So that is going to be, that is going to be my offer and if you do it just email me the receipt and I will set you up a membership for it but — so I am going to give that link after you give yours so go ahead and tell everybody you know, what is the best way that they kind of follow you, get in touch with you, learn more about you, contact you and that kind of thing.

Yaro Starak: Yeah, yeah. By the time you are listening to this, the thing you want to go and grab as a starting point is my blog profits blueprint. Now, Jeremy, you should have a link for that I think is a worth giving out because then the people who do buy to get your bonus it will track that correctly. So I think the first thing you want to give people is a link to the blog profits blueprint and then yes that is an 88-page document. The first version of that I obviously updated it but the first version of that came out in 2007. It has been downloaded well over a 150,000 times and it is really a starting point for so many blogs. I am amazed how many people come up in the events and say, you know what, I read through your blueprint you know, I did not even buy your course necessarily but I just went to your free stuff and this blueprint in particular. I started my blog which started my online business which pretty much changed the entire course of my life in terms of what I do for a living. So I love hearing that to start with. So that is why the blueprint is the starting point.

So everything we have talked about here it goes through setting up the blog, the blog sales funnel selling new products and service through blogging, content marketing all of that, great entry point. And then if you want to work more closely and have a more step-by-step guide, the blog mastermind 2.0, the course and obviously you know, definitely grab Jeremy’s bonus. I actually cannot think of much of a better tie-ins since I am essentially teaching the blog sales funnel combined it with your funnel formula you got a pretty awesome combination of funnel training which I think is really the — not only the current hot format of marketing, it is just what works best you know, I think I leave Jeremy to give you the links wherever you are downloading this for those 2 things.

Finding my work, it is really straightforward, Google my name, Yaro. It is a bit of strange first name I am trying to be like Oprah and Madonna (inaudible 64:31.0) you know 1 name fame. So Google Yaro and you will find me, Yaro.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, yeah sounds good. And I do not have these links up yet but what I will do is if you want the — Yaro, do you think we should have 2 separate links or maybe just 1 page with both of them?

Yaro Starak: Well, I mean it depends what time are you giving this out because if you give out the blueprint before the course is on sale, they cannot buy for the bonus yet so —

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, so we will go live during your prelaunch so everybody can follow that.

Yaro Starak: Okay, so they should get the blueprint and the free one.

Jeremy Reeves: Okay, yeah. So if you want that and again as usual all these links are going to be in the show notes. So if you are on your phone just kind of scroll down in the description and the links will be there. If you are coming to this from the email then you will go to the page and the show notes will be in there but go to Jeremyreeves.com/Yaro and that will like kind of — you know that will essentially be my affiliate link that sends you to the blog profit blueprint and then if you end up buying the blog mastermind 2.0 from Yaro then just shoot me that receipt and I will send you also the funnel formula course so you kind of get like a 2-in-1 deal.

Yaro Starak: Awesome.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, sounds good. And again, those will all be in the show notes. Before we hop off, is there anything else that you know that I missed, is there anything that you know, you would kind of feel bad if people did not know or you think we covered kind of the big points?

Yaro Starak: You know there are so many things to this I would not want to overwhelm people. I know depending where are you coming from, there is a lot of moving parts to this whole process and that is why sometimes I think just going out there and saying okay I am going to be this kind of expert, I am going to setup a blog and I am going to build a list and get out there and start doing that process is the best learning experience you can have. So you know, if any of this is felt overwhelming or confusing, just break it down into small pieces of the puzzle with an emphasis on output, making something for the world though so you can actually get someone to consume your content and join your list and start having a relationship with you because that is what leads to the sales is the trust in the relationship.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Brilliant advise. Once again, if you are interested in learning more about this, the best way to do it is by getting Yaro’s the free 88-page blog profits blueprint and the link to get that is Jeremyreeves.com/Yaro and you know, again if you have any questions from me about all this you know, feel free to email me at [email protected] otherwise you can kind of you know, search for Yaro and he is doing the whole Oprah thing. Hey, you know, if they search for Yaro and click one of your links that will help you in Google because they like you know, that is one of the ranking factors (inaudible 67:24.1).

Yaro Starak: I have rank number 1 for Yaro for the long time now, 10 years.

Jeremy Reeves: That is awesome. Yes, I hope everybody you know, got a lot out of this I know I did and again, Jeremyreeves.com/Yaro that will be in the show notes, so just scroll down you know, wherever you are listening to this and then just click on that link and yeah, if you end up buying anything again, that will take you to the free thing. If you end up buying anything then I will get the commission for it and thank you for that by the way and then I will also send you the funnel formula as well. Alright.

Yaro Starak: Awesome.

Jeremy Reeves: Yeah, thanks.

Yaro Starak: Thank you Jeremy.

Jeremy Reeves: I really appreciate it.

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